Meet Shanika Jackson Kinsey

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Welcome back to another episode of the Hilltop Glove Podcast. Today we have the pleasure of speaking with Shanika Jackson Kinsey, a spectacular spectacular mixed media visual artist. She hails from Windsboro, South Carolina, and when she's not inspiring young minds in the classroom, you can find her in the studio passionately creating art. Renowned for her portrait work, Shanika aspires to pursue art full time. Her journey into the world of art began at the tender age of three years old, where she started drawing on the back of her grandfather's living room door with shoe polish. Her passion then led her to Benedict College, where I met her, where she earned her Bachelor's of Arts degree in 2013. She specializes in commissioned artwork, skillfully using colored pencils, markers, and oil pastels. And her primary focus is on self-portraits, where she captures the essence of each soul through techniques like crosshatching. She's currently a visual art teacher at Lee County School District in Bishopville, South Carolina. And we are happy to have you today. How are you? I'm doing well. How are you? Doing great. Nice to be here. Long time no see. I literally haven't seen you since 2013. Absolutely. But I'm I'm glad that you were able to join us today. Um, of course, I've always admired your artwork. Thank you. And you brought some work for us. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:28

We always love when people bring work. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:31

Um, Shanika, ever since I met you in at Benedict College, you've always been focused on self-portraits. So can you tell us about uh your upbringing? You have any brothers or sisters, and who inspired you?

SPEAKER_02 1:44

Okay, awesome. So before I did the shoe polish painting on my grandfather's door, I was born to my mother. Um I have a younger sister, one older sister, and one older brother. Okay. Um and I grew up between Windsboro and Denmark, South Carolina. Um, for the most part, I am very faith-based. And so I was born, I was raised in the church. My grandfather was a pastor. Um, he was my pastor before he passed. And so I've just been faith-based and, you know, good country girl, like just artsy all my life. So I think um you mentioned the shoe polish um portraits. I do want to speak on it. So my grandfather um was watching me and my mother was at work, and um, you know, it was just getting a little antsy. And so my grandfather, because he was a preacher, he used to polish his shoes. He left his polish out. He never does, but he left one out that day. And I was like, I wonder what I could do with this stuff. And so I grabbed it, I went to his door outside, peeped around the corner. He was asleep, and I drew this lady. She was horrible looking, looked like a little tic-tac-toe lady. It was horrible. Um, my mother came home, of course, and you know, what mama wanna do? She was like, girl, are you crazy? Like, I got your behind, but my granddad was like, No, leave it there. So I had the pleasure of looking at this horrible picture every day when I would come to my grandfather's house because it's the door stayed up until he passed away. And then he took it down. And I think my aunt has it somewhere in storage. So like that door is still somewhere with that lady on it. They never painted over it. And I think that just pushed me, you know, it propelled me into continuing to create. So when my grandfather believed in me at such a young age, you know, he could have painted over that door a long time ago. I'm 37 years old. That door could be in no existence, but it's still, you know, it still exists today. So it's just powerful to me. It's just a reminder to always just be true to who I am. You know, always remember my upbringing where I'm from and just keep pushing for it.

unknown 3:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:29

I like what you said about um he believed in you while you were young. Because it always takes that one person to see something in you as a child, and then later on down the line, it became your work of art. Absolutely. Like your profession.

SPEAKER_02 3:45

And I think that stuck with me so much because as I got older, you know, I had a lot of bullies. People always not believing in me, always telling me a lie. And I began to believe those lies, you know, they stayed with me for so long. And then it just, you know, I just shook

The Shoe Polish Door Origin

SPEAKER_02 3:59

past. I was like, you know what? I have to start telling myself the truth. And like you said, my grandfather believed in me at such a young age. My mother believed in me, my father believed in me. Those are the people that take care of me, those are the people that are important to me. So I stopped caring what bullies had to say. I no longer allowed them to hold me down. I started to push past that. So art became my voice at a very young age, and it still is to this day. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 4:21

It still is. And what drew you to doing portraits?

SPEAKER_02 4:24

I've always been fascinated with eyes. I have a cousin named Geraldine. She has these very beautiful almond-shaped eyes. They're very pretty. In fact, her eyes would have to be the first set of eyes I drew. Um, and I drew them from memory. I just was staring her face. She was a very soft-spoken, she's she is a very soft-spoken person with a very beautiful voice. And I used to love just to listen to her. And one day I was just looking at her face, and I was captivated. She had these really pretty brown eyes, and they're not gray now as she gets older. And I just remember drawing them. And then once I drew her eyes, I was like, hmm, I wonder what it looked like if I drew my granddad's eyes or my mom's eyes. I just kept going. I just started drawing almost everywhere. It's like eyes everywhere looking at me. So I was always drawing them. Um, and then I decided to draw my own eyes. They're very big. Um, I remember when I had I had COVID back in 2020. I went to work, caught it at work, and so I was sick and I was very scared because they told you, you know, if you have diabetes or asthma, don't go out there. Because you know I ended up catching. Yeah, and I had I have both. So I was terrified. I thought I was leaving here. So I was like, I'm gonna leave my eye here. So if something happens to me, somebody's gonna know what I look like. And so I drew it, and I ended up drawing work. I actually drew not this one, but I did another picture of Cynthia Ravo, but the blue one. Um, the peak of my COVID I was had 106 temp. Oh my! And I drew that picture. That's a hallucinating temperature. I closed my door and I was like, I'm just gonna leave something here and leave my mark. So I drew that picture. I drew that picture, and it ended up being like one of the most renowned pieces that I've ever done. So many people wanted it. I finally sold it last year, it was so devastating to me. But I loved it. You know, I was ex it was exciting because that piece marked such a pivotal moment in my life, you know, that to leave my mark is the most important message that I have here, and that's to do that. So art is my voice, and so that's what I wanted to do. Make sure I left that here.

SPEAKER_04 6:12

But I'm still here, so what's your son? When are you born? I'm an Aquarius. An Aquarius, my wife's an Aquarius. We got a house full of Aquarians. I can see that.

SPEAKER_01 6:21

That reminds me of Frida Kahlo, you know, drawing yourself. Yes, yes. Yeah, yes. Can you talk about how did you get the courage to, you know, pursue art though, like as a as a career and actually going to college? Because a lot of people think like, oh, you're just gonna be a starving artist. It's not a full career, you don't need to get your degree in that. You talk about the journey.

SPEAKER_02 6:43

So I don't know if you know this, Tamari, but when I first started Benedict, I was a um general ed teacher. I wanted to be an early elementary teacher.

SPEAKER_00 6:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 6:51

I was 17 when I started. So my mom was like, girl, you're gonna go where it's the money at, and right now they need teachers. You're gonna do

Why Eyes Anchor Her Portraits

SPEAKER_02 6:57

that. And I was like, okay, so I did it. Um but my seat, my dream year, I got really sick, and I was like, I can't keep doing this. You know, I'm lying to myself. That's not what I really want to do. So I had a long conversation with my mom. I said, Hey mom, I know I'm getting ready to go to my senior year, but I want to change my major. Of course, mom was like, Are you crazy? I did not know this. Wow. She was like, Why would you do that? And Kenyetta, Kenyatta, hey, she was like, and tie in. Tyane was he was like, Why don't you just come on over? You know, we got the professors, show them your work, and then let's see what happens. And I was like, Mom, I think I can do it. She said, Well, you know what? You run out of your money, you're gonna have to figure that thing out. And I said, Yes, ma'am. And I made a promise to my mom that I was gonna give it my very best. So I walked into um Dr. Wild's room and I showed him my work, and he was like, Oh, we got something here. Let's see what we can do. And that's how I ended up doing art. Um, and with A, with this sense of AI out, you have people are saying the art is a dying form, but I'm not gonna allow it to die. You know what I'm saying? I feel like real artistry comes from passion, you know, and as much as I like AI, it's not passionate, it's all computerized.

SPEAKER_04 8:01

I think I think AI is gonna take over some of what clip art was doing for a while.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

Absolutely, and it's fine, but it won't take my real art.

SPEAKER_04 8:07

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 8:08

It's nothing like that. Nothing like it. Because you capture like the essence, like you say, of the person. I'm gonna tell you what I do before I do portraits, you know, I pray. Have a long conversation with God, and I also have a long conversation with whomever it is that I'm painting. For example, I have a lot of people asking me to draw deceased loved ones. That's a hard thing for me because I know at one point what they won't really what they really want is a reminder, a constant memory of who that person is. And so most of the time with artists that do portrait break, we want things to be identical to the photo. Yeah, I don't do that anymore. I used to, and it used to rip me into shreds because it had none of my soul. It was just drawing directly from what I saw. But I was like, I can't do that anymore. So I would pray. After I pray over all the things I'm gonna use, I pray over the images and I ask that person, especially if they're deceased, shine through.

unknown 8:57

You know?

SPEAKER_02 8:57

And that's what I think. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, then I cut on some music and I move because music is very inspirational to me. Um, so it's it ranges between RB gospel, a little hip-hop, a little neo-soul, reggae, whatever it is that I'm feeling in the moment, that's what I tap into and I just move forward through there. And like you said, you know, art they say that you be a starving artist, you know. I don't think I'm starving because it's spirit that's feeding me. Yeah, you understand what I'm saying? So that you know, I may not have the monetary parts of it, but all the other beautiful things that come from being an artist always they're always present. Yeah. So it's fun for me, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 9:35

So as a mixed media artist, how has your process evolved? Oh, that's a good question.

SPEAKER_02 9:40

Um, I started off with charcoal, and that's all I wanted to do. And you know how you get to a point where you're good at something, you don't want to stop doing that, right? So I just did everything in charcoal. My senior project was in charcoal, everything was in charcoal. I had charco everywhere, fingertips was black.

SPEAKER_01 9:55

Like, you know, she would be in the studio all the time, just drawing all night.

SPEAKER_02 10:00

Yes, all different types of charcoal. My mom was like, girl, my house is black because that's all I would use. I can't remember which one of my professors I want to say might have been Mr. Jeter. Jeter, you already know it's Jita. We interviewed Mr. Jeter too. Awesome. Yeah, so he gave me that content, you know, the brown. And he was like, try that. It might have been Dr. Wild's, honestly. I don't know, one of them. But it was like, try this, and I would play with that a little bit and I go back to the charcoal. Play with that a little bit, go back to the charcoal. And then Miss Gina Moore, our professor, who actually showed me pastels, and she was the one who actually introduced me into Prisma color, color pencils. Um, I was using the Crayolas, you know, but I could afford. And so I got to those Prisma colors. I think the first pack I ever paid for was like $50. I was like, I can't, I can't afford these things, but they work like gold, you know. And I was like, I like these things. I kind of married them, you know? And so um I think the pieces require what I use. You know, oftentimes they'll tell me, hey, can you do a color pencil drawing? I was like, okay, cool. I look at the picture and I'll tell them, hey, so those color pencils aren't gonna work. But I got you. I'm gonna use what I think is best. And so that's what I do now. So um I evolved from black and white images to actually exploring color. I feel like I was horrible at it at first, but as I kept going, yeah, because I was scared. Right. But once I allowed my free with it and move with it, I started

Switching Majors And Beating Doubt

SPEAKER_02 11:21

noticing that the color pencils liked me a whole lot. So I started moving forward with those. Um and then I would do the pastels. I kind of I think I started from charcoal to pastels because they look they look alike. They're both square around. And so then I worked my way over into the color pencils again. Yeah. So yeah. Almost like went back to the basics.

SPEAKER_04 11:37

What about your uh your technique and your style? Has that evolved too over the time?

SPEAKER_02 11:42

It actually has. You know, remember I was telling you I was like, I was kind of like stuck in a box. I wanted things to look just like the image, I no longer do that anymore. So now I tap into what I need to do, what feels the most. I think I had this one image um where this young lady was like my dad's eyes. It was like, oh my God, I could really see him through the eyes. But I I focused on them so much. I remember I think I took two hours on his eyes alone. Never done that before. And I was like, why am I so focused on this man's eyes? Like he just got eyes. But when I gave her a picture, she was like, oh my god, it's like he's looking at me.

SPEAKER_00 12:16

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:16

So I just feel like I feel like the images were called, well, the images call me into what I need to pay most attention to, and I just move forward with it. It seemed like everything else flows so quickly. But then when I get to a certain spot that needs to shine, I take so long going up, okay. You're calling my attention to their nose. It's a reason why. Let me let me focus and let me, you know, get into it. And so that's what I do.

SPEAKER_01 12:37

Yeah. But I love how uh vulnerable you are in the process, in the whole process, because you know, sometimes being an artist, you can be in your head the whole time, but it's like you're open in receiving the messages as they come. I take myself out of the picture.

SPEAKER_02 12:52

So it's because at the end of the day, the message is the most important. And so, you know, like I said, if you have like a like I said, a deceased individual who I'm drawing, I want what they want to say to the person that that I that commissioned me, I want their message to be heard. So oftentimes I can say I pray. So I ask God, so listen, because you know, I teach.

SPEAKER_00 13:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:13

So when I get home, you know what you want to do. You want to go to sleep. You don't want to do any work. But I was like, so listen, God, I'm running on fumes. You're gonna have to do this picture. So whatever it is that you desire for it for it to be seen, allow that to be done. And so that's what I've been doing. I think um, I think what really challenges me the most now is just finding time and balance um to comp to create these pieces. And then once I do that, it's all smooth sailing from there.

SPEAKER_01 13:40

I was gonna ask you that question next. How do you even find balance with you know teaching and then doing the commissions to, you know. Kind of lie to myself. Okay. So like, you know, fine.

SPEAKER_02 13:54

It's fine. Yeah, just just a lot to myself. Like, say for example, I get off work and I know I have a I have a picture that needs to be done before the end of the month, I lie to myself and say this thing needs to be done by Saturday. Oh, yeah. You know what I'm saying? Even though, even though I have two, three weeks left, I tell myself, Friday, you need to have this thing done. So even if I'm not done, I'm at a really good point where I can know I have it done by the time the due date comes. And so I find time. Like I said, um, I went somewhere, what day was that, Thursday? I got home at 1.15 in the morning, went to sleep, got up, went straight to work. I had to get up at 5 30 so I can get to work by 7. And then I got home and then I got a little bit of rest and I woke back up to do it again. But I also found time in between my rest and waking up this morning to work on a picture that's due by next weekend. So it's just focusing and you know management. Absolutely. Time management is very important, especially when you have a job and you're a creative, you know. You have to find that balance because if not, one's gonna lose. And I'm gonna tell you the truth, my art's not gonna lose. So I'm not gonna let that happen.

SPEAKER_04 14:55

So there's like a compulsion to make art, I feel like, with a lot of artists. Like you just kind of you have to do it.

SPEAKER_02 15:00

Yeah, I get sometimes I get waking up in my sleep. Now I'll be asleep, and I'll gotta be like, get up, you got something to do, and I move, I go right into it. Yeah. And then my mom's like, this girl, it's like three o'clock in the morning. Why is she up? Well, maybe I need to tap in.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

I'll get a message and I'll be like, All right, go stretch at three in the morning, not go draw. Like, but uh, maybe I just need to, you know.

SPEAKER_02 15:21

Take your sketchpad when you go stretch. Honestly, yeah. Okay. And I'm I won't say I've done that since 2013.

Prayer Music And Capturing Essence

SPEAKER_02 15:28

There's been moments where I haven't done art, you know. But what I also learned is that I felt like I was starving. Like something was missing. And then when I have like all these colors around me, I feel great. You know, like I always keep a little pack with pins and markers and sharpies and all those things on me. Cause I never know when I'm going to feel like I want to create. I don't play about my markers.

SPEAKER_01 15:47

No. I always got a whole set of markers. You had a question skip?

SPEAKER_03 15:52

Yeah. Um, because you said, of course, you work the school year. Do you do you feel like when you're out of school that you have more time that you can commit to commissions? Or you absolutely okay.

SPEAKER_02 16:03

Summertime honing straight in, I'm going straight into the art, doing exactly what I have to do. Um, I like to pick up a job, but if I don't, then I do straight commissions. And that's when I do most of my work. Yeah, or when I work on my own personal pieces that I want to do. Yeah. Okay. That was a good question, though.

SPEAKER_00 16:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 16:20

How do you charge for your artwork? Like, is it by size or technique or materials?

SPEAKER_02 16:26

So they used to be $75 straight. Whatever you wanted, whatever size you wanted, was $75 straight. Um, and I'ma say to I'm gonna tell you to I don't know if you remember I did that sculpture in Mr. Wild's Dr. Wiles class. I sold it for $50. Mr. G berated me to no end. He said we lost your everlasting mind. We didn't know. Yeah, yeah. We didn't know, you know? And he was like, You spent. He said, let's calculate it. So he sat me down and he calculated. He was like, and I looked at him, he was like, You see how much money you could have gotten for. I'm making 10 cents an hour. He was like $50. He said, when everybody was gone home, you were still in that studio working on that sculpture. He said the thing was heavy because you put so much time into it, and you gave it to her for $50. I wanted that to sit with you. And so, like I said, I graduated. I need money. I didn't have a job when I first left Benedict. So I'm like, I gotta do something. So I'm drawing. I did I illustrated a whole book for $200. I sat down with myself and I said, something has to change.

SPEAKER_00 17:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:30

Because I'm spending too much time doing these things. And though I don't want my work to be so expensive, you know what I'm saying? Because it's artwork and it's hard work. So I don't want it to be like super duper expensive, but I also want to make sure that I'm able to buy the supplies I need to continue doing it. And so um my new my new flyer for my fee says products have improved, quality of work is improved, therefore the price must improve. So when I used to pay like, used to charge like $75 for whatever you desired from me, I now charge $150 for an 11 by 17. Why? Because it's worth it.

Pricing Originals And Choosing Materials

SPEAKER_02 18:06

You understand? And so what I've been doing is just making sure that I'm paying myself so that I can afford to continue to keep doing it. Because like you said, art is a starving, it's a starving profession. Unless you have like this really big deal with someone, you're able to make these monies. You can't do it without actually charging what you're worth. I still, you know, I feel like I charge a great amount for what I do, but I still have people tell me I'm not charging enough. Yeah. So yeah. But so each piece is a one of one, like you don't create there's no prints. No prints, okay. Yeah. I know we got prints today because I was like, I gotta bring, you know, do something. But yeah, it's their original pieces. Everything I do is an original piece. There's no other copy of it nowhere. That's another price.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

The price, what DJ Callie said, the price is going up. Today's price is not yesterday's price.

SPEAKER_02 18:51

Yeah. And so I told him with the inflation, it's gonna go up, it's probably gonna go up again, you know. But right now I'm I'm comfortable with the prices. I'm comfortable with the prices as it relates to the size that I'm you know, doing it, especially with like color pencils. You know, color pencils to a piece of paper is like an ant in a big field, you know what I'm saying? So, and those prism colors are not getting cheap, you know, because I like to buy them by the bulk. So they're like 200 every time I, you know, get a pack, you know. So I'm just very careful. And I also learned how to say no to some people. Um, if your spirit doesn't feel well with me, and I feel like it's not gonna, we're not melting, like we're not working, I said, no, I'm sorry, I don't have the time to do it, you know. But I had to learn that because I was starting burning out. I got to a place where I was like, I don't want to do it. I don't want to do it. And I, you know, God was like, You can't, you can't give up. This is what I called you to do. This is your message, you know. It's almost like um Jacob Lawrence, you know, he grew up in a time where he didn't have a voice, you know, being a black man. And during the Harlem Renaissance time, and what he did was he used his art to be his voice. So he was able to spread his message that way. And God's giving me that same ability to do that, you know? And I can't sit there and pretend like I don't have a voice because I do, even if this thing doesn't work, my hand still does. You know, so I have to put my message out. I have to. It's my charge.

SPEAKER_03 20:09

Yeah. So I got a question. So why or so what's the difference between Prisma colored pencils and just like some regular colored pencils I buy at Walmart?

SPEAKER_02 20:18

So I love a little Crayola.

SPEAKER_03 20:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:21

That's that's my best friend. I I'll tap back into those at all times. But those prisma has this like richness in them. You know, it's like a the pigment is stronger, the colors are more vibrant. You know, and I've tried others. I have the Coron De Arches, I might be saying the wrong, forgive me. I like them, but they're also like they feel weird, they feel waxy. But those prismas, they all they just feel really earthy. You know, it's like we came from this, and it just that's what they feel like to me, like really nice. Um, and they are very um, what's the word I want to use? Like, I feel married to them. So I feel like we have a connection. So when I try other products, I use Prismacolor Everything. Okay. Prismacolor markers, Prismacolor pastels, yes, and you're looking at me because you know that means them things are expensive, but I stand true to them because I know they have great quality products, you know. I don't use Copic. And I like Copit, I think it's beautiful, but it just doesn't work with me. Okay, yeah. So I'm just like I just have like this real relationship with Prismacolors. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 21:20

One of the things I found about using more expensive paints is like you use less of them. Like you get more vibrance out of the a little bit. So it's almost like they're not that much more expensive.

SPEAKER_02 21:31

Right. Because you get way more out of them. Yeah, and I go get me those pencil extenders, you know. So I got a couple of, so it's like a girl. I fell in love with them when I found out about them. So I had like this nub of this dark brown prisma color that was this big. And I was like doing this because I wanted to use them. I was watching an artist. Oh, I feel bad because I can't remember her name right now. Heather. I can't remember her last name. Beautiful color pencil works. And I watched her pull out this little thing. I was like, what is that? It's a little little tube like a pencil, and it has like this thing that you can tighten. Oh, it screws on it. Pencil makes it on. Oh, you can hit the wind of it. Yeah, and I was like, wait a minute, that's a life changer. So I went to Amazon. I was like, hey, where these things are, and I found them. And after that, every little bit of the pencil. Poor little notes. I'm using them up. Yeah. Using them all the way up.

SPEAKER_01 22:23

So let's talk about your role as a teacher. How has it feeled your inspiration as an artist as well, teaching the kids?

SPEAKER_02 22:32

You know, we are here to lead by example and also teach children how to find their own individuality and their voices. And so it's me, because right now I'm in a special education classroom. Okay. And so what I'm focused on now is making sure they understand their voices. They understand that they have a message they have to put out, and they understand they also have a responsibility in society. Oftentimes we tell children, wait until you're an adult. Absolutely not. Nope. No. It starts right now. It starts right now. As soon as you're able to open your mouth, you're able to speak, your message starts right then and there. And I don't want my children to feel like they have to be quiet. You know, no, say what you need to say. You understand? It's a way to say it, how to say it, and just be true to yourself. And I think that, you know, it I didn't always feel that way. You understand? Because when I first started teaching, I was put in a classroom without actual no actual background. And I taught high school. Oh wow. Right. So I'm walking in and who was like walking like Daniel the Lions then. Like, what am I trying to do? You know? And they were like ravenous, ready to take me down, you know. And I'm also one of those type of people I get pretty like nervous in crowds, and I'm like, how am I gonna teach? Like, what am I what why did I sign up with this? That's why I didn't want to do this in the first place. I don't like being in front of people. But I think when I first started at um Indy County, I had a classroom at that time. They were just reintroducing art into the district. They did they had lost the whole program. Okay. They were just reintroducing us. Um and that's actually how I got in. I worked with the Auntie Karen Foundation that summer. Um, HR liked me and asked me to come back. I thought they were joking, but no, they actually called me back. So I walk in and there's no students assigned to me at the moment. So I'm like, what am I doing?

Teaching Kids To Use Their Voice

SPEAKER_02 24:13

You know, it's eight o'clock. I'm ready to get started, but I'm not ready to get started. You know, two girls walk in. I'm gonna tell you, I think they were cutting. I think they just found somewhere to go right quick, so they didn't have to go. But they walked in and was like, hey, we your students. I'm like, okay, I write them down on the roll, you know. I get started with them. And at the end of the session, one of the young ladies, I don't want to call her name, but she's really cool. She was like, she was like, you know what? I think I'm gonna like this class. I'm gonna sign up for it for real. And I was like, sign up for it for real.

unknown 24:41

They wasn't on my roster.

SPEAKER_02 24:42

Oh my god, these children just cut in my classroom. They had so much fun with them. And they actually signed up and they stayed in my class the whole time and they would work. She was like, I really like this class, but I think they were able to, like I said, you know, say what they really wanted to say. Right. Because oftentimes children are silenced. And so I I leave space for them not to be silenced. And even right now with the job that I do now, I still let those children be as as expressive as they want to be. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:10

What advice would you give an inspiring artist? Don't give up.

SPEAKER_02 25:14

You know, society, like I said, with this age of AI, society is telling us that we no longer are needed. But yes, we are.

SPEAKER_00 25:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:21

Our message, you know, your message is yours, yours alone, you know. And there's no one else that can give the message that you have but you. And if you do not put your message out, you're failing people. There's so many people that are listening to you. You know, you get what I'm saying? You have an assigned set of people that have to hear what you need to say so that they'll be able to say what they need to say. And if you give up on yourself, you're messing up on those people that need you as well. So my biggest, my biggest advice to an aspiring artist, or just anybody and anybody, be true to you. Listen to yourself, hear what you what you have to say, and let your message shine. It's the most important thing to me.

SPEAKER_01 26:02

So if people were interested in contacting you or commission work, how can they find you?

SPEAKER_02 26:09

Well, um Instagram at nappy underscore acroacro on Instagram, TikTok, and then on my Facebook is Shanika Jackson Kenzie. And you can get a contact with me, and I got you.

SPEAKER_01 26:24

If you have any last words, anything you think that you might say driving home or forgot to say, or make sure that you are true to yourself.

SPEAKER_02 26:35

Do not believe the lies. You know your truth. Hone into it, and then remember that you have a voice, you have a message that needs to be heard. It's yours individually, and everybody is waiting for you to open your mouth.

SPEAKER_01 26:48

I love that. Absolutely. My was closed for so long, and I was starting.

SPEAKER_02 26:53

Especially not artists.

SPEAKER_01 26:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:55

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

We appreciate you. Thank you for having me. I had fun.

SPEAKER_04 26:59

It's been an honor.

SPEAKER_01 26:59

Thank you. We're thinking about having an art day soon, so we'll definitely invite you to that. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 27:04

I'm down for it. Oh, before we wrap up, I do got a question. Yes. Because you specialize in doing portraits. What is the hardest feature to draw on a human face and why?

SPEAKER_01 27:19

Oh, I I love those things. She got that in the bag.

SPEAKER_04 27:23

I mean, I think those are hard. You just might have got a mastery down of them, but that's eyes are fun.

SPEAKER_02 27:28

Eyes are fun. They're just they're circles with your soul inside. Yeah, exactly. That's what they are, you know? And I like I said, I think my I'm spirit, I I do work through spirit. So I think that's why eyes are so easy for me. Um, I did a portrait, a self-a family portrait of my friend who has these very um, you know, they're beautiful eyes, but she speaks through her eyes. Her eyes talk to you before she even opened her mouth. And I did a I did the picture of her, and for some reason her eyes just sparkled on the picture. I was like, the photo don't look like that. What's happening? But I had to think about, oh, she's a soul, her eyes are like soulful. So I tapped into it. So that's what's sparkling the most. She was like, girl, you just got my eyes like you know, I was like, you spoke to me that way, you know. But I think the hardest feature now for me are nose, nostrils. Um, and I think I was taught to draw myself most to catch on. And so sometimes when like I draw from photos, and at the high res like, you gotta get a good something Mr. GD used to always say is the reference has to be just as good so you can do the art really well. And a lot of people give me like pictures from 1964, you know, 1970, like granddaddy, you know, and I'm like, oh God, you know, so pictures are focused. Yes, it's our laugh because sometimes some of their noses look like mine. No because I'm always drawing it, you know, and like I can't see it

Noses Practice Marketing And Farewell

SPEAKER_02 28:52

on the picture. So I'm like, that's my neck get a little flat little biscuit nose right quick, you know. But yeah, right now I'm really like focusing on trying to get these noses and his nostrils down pat because like I said, some of these people's pictures are starting to look like mine, my nose. I'm like, I can't do that to everybody, you know. Can't have this man with this nice pointy nose having this like flat nose like mine. So I gotta be very careful with it. But but I'm working on it, you know, practicing in my sketchbook.

SPEAKER_00 29:17

Excellent.

unknown 29:17

Thanks.

SPEAKER_02 29:17

Thank you. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_04 29:19

It's neat that you bring up sketchbook, though. Like, like you keep keep honing the craft.

SPEAKER_02 29:25

Practice, practice makes permanent.

SPEAKER_04 29:27

Not just working on the big pieces, but some little elements that keep you going.

SPEAKER_02 29:31

Absolutely. Yeah, practice makes permanent. A lot of people say practice makes perfect, but it doesn't. It just makes permanent something that stays in your head. So you know, like when you repetition, when you repeat something over and over again, it starts to get embedded inside of you. That's what sketching is. It's just constantly doing it, constantly doing it, where it's just memory, muscle memory. Muscle memory. You know, yeah. Sometimes I like to close my eyes and just draw to see what comes out. And it's crazy because it's always an eyeball, you know, it's always mouth or nose or something, you know. But yeah. And I'm actually learning now how to draw other things. I've been so, you know, you get so boxed up to just drawing portraits and pictures of people all of the time. I was like, this is all I know how to do. I can't draw a cartoon character because I want the thing to look realistic, you know. So I'm focusing now on just drawing everything.

SPEAKER_00 30:13

But that's right.

SPEAKER_02 30:13

So, like, yeah. So sometimes if I'm outside, I'm looking at a tree and I see it like dancing a little bit, yeah. I just sketch it out, you know?

unknown 30:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:20

Just to wake my hands up, give them, give me something else to remember.

unknown 30:23

I love it.

SPEAKER_01 30:24

That's good.

SPEAKER_02 30:24

It's like an exercise. That's what it is. There's like your yoga. Yeah, that's why I told you to take that sketchbook with you.

SPEAKER_01 30:30

Yeah, it's so crazy when you tell someone you're an artist, they're like, Oh, can you draw my face? Oh, but everybody always wants the face.

SPEAKER_02 30:36

They always immediately and their favorite line after that is for free.

SPEAKER_00 30:40

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:41

And I've done it, you know, a couple of times, you know. I did a picture of Lena Ways, and I'll I don't know if you guys know, Miss Um Auntie Karen Foundation does a thing called the YEC, the Young Entrepreneur Conference that she does. It's really nice. She brings in children from the ages of, don't make me lie, I want to say six to eighteen or 21, 21, 6 to 21. They come in, they're artists of all whatever, like dancers, musicians, whatever you could think of, and they'll come in. Um, and what they'll do is they'll have like after they have their sessions, they have like this art show where you can go in and make purchases and stuff. And I had this leaning waste picture that I didn't like. Shh, quite clap. I didn't like it that much. I also drew that during the time I had COVID. Um this little young lady and she walked up to me. She's like, How much is this piece? Can I have it? And I just looked at it and I was like, Yeah, take it. You can take it. And she ran around. She was like, hey, she gave me two this gave me this for free. And I'm like, oh, why did I do that? It's not everybody's running up. Can I do this for free? And I was like, you know, that was the only piece I had for that. But you know, like I said, I'm okay with drawing people for free. But I also, like I said, it's according to what their souls feel like. I'm not doing that for everybody. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 31:47

Yeah. There's something weird with the supply-demand curve when you have to make the art and then people don't have to buy it. So it just doesn't work. It doesn't work.

SPEAKER_02 31:57

And I also, something else I do with my pieces, I draw sc write scriptures in the back. Uh oh. Yeah. So, and I haven't been doing that forever. Don't don't get me wrong. I think I started drawing writing the scriptures in the back, I want to say back in 2023. And that changed the whole trajectory for me. Um, I would pray. And at the end of this, the drawing, the scripture would just come to me. I'll go look it up in my Bible and oh, that's good. And I'll write it in the back. And so, you know, and I also tell the client, so listen, I wrote a scripture in the back. Also, because I want to respect them as well. But, you know, I have to be honest about my belief. Yeah. So I write the scripture in the back and then go for it. And it's the ones I wrote the scriptures on, you gotta, I'm telling you, it's crazy. That's all I can say. It's different, it's whole different. I was like, um, I drew, you know, Love is Blind, you ever seen that show? Love is Blind. Cameron and Lauren's one of the first couples on there. And for some reason, that little story just caught me up. So I drew them and then I contacted Lawrence's brother. I was like, hey, so listen, I just want to get this to them. I don't need to know their information. Can you help me? He said, sure. So I sent it to him, sent it to her. That was the very first piece I ever wrote a scripture on the back of.

SPEAKER_00 33:03

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

And I sent it to him. He sent it to them, and then she put it up on Instagram.

SPEAKER_00 33:07

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_02 33:08

And immediately me, and I just listened to what God told me to do. You know, because like I told you, I don't like doing stuff like that. But God was like, girl, put a thing out there. I did it, and I gained maybe like 500 extra followers. And from those 500 extra followers, I got like a hundred commissions. Wow. Oh wow. Yeah, and I needed, I needed them. All of them for $75. All of those pictures for $75. I cannot imagine if I was charging them what I'm charging now. You know, like I I would have had a little extra cushion, but I did every piece, all set all $100 for $75. And I felt so good. I felt so good. Yeah. So I just that's why I said the message is the important part. Not necessarily like the financial parts of it. Hey, that's a great part, but the message is the most important part. I tell people all the time I'm an artist from my heart, and I'm true to that, you know. So that's that.

SPEAKER_01 33:56

I love that. You're being true to yourself. Have to. And you're walking and living in your authentic self.

SPEAKER_02 34:02

I spent so long hiding myself. Um, but Layla Hathaway has a song and it's called Mirrors, and in the back it says, Sometimes you have to make the mirror your best friend, and then maybe then you'll find some peace within. Stop hiding yourself, love yourself when no one else can. So I had to do that. That's one of my favorite songs, you know. And I had to do that. I had to keep telling myself, you know, society tells me that I don't nobody want to see me. You know what I'm saying? I'm a here I am, a plus-size black woman, natural. I don't wear makeup, don't do none of those things. Ain't nobody paying you no attention. That's what society is telling me. But I know that's not the truth.

unknown 34:37

Right.

SPEAKER_02 34:37

Because my heart is what matters, you know. And so, like I said, I focus on my message. I don't care what no one else thinks. And I used to, and now that I don't, I have so much peace. I made the mirror my best friend, literally. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

You got so many um good jaw-dropping moments. I wonder what Skip is gonna name this episode.

SPEAKER_03 34:57

Putting ever and stuff in. That's a really good episode.

SPEAKER_01 35:00

Yeah, thank you so much. No problem. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 35:03

Before we wrap up, I do want to give a shout-out to this wonderful space that we're in, Celeb Studio. If uh you are looking for a place to record your podcast or other media production, uh, look us up on ShareSpace. Oh, Pearspace. Peer Space.

SPEAKER_01 35:19

Yes. And we're just gonna wrap up the episode by telling someone that you love them. This was a great creative space, and I'm glad that you were here. Thank you. I'm glad to be here. I had fun. You guys are amazing. And Almoir. Like and subscribe, and we'll talk, we'll see you guys soon.

SPEAKER_04 35:40

Peace.